Video Interview: Klaus Obermeyer

1993.023.0001 Video History Klaus Obermeyer

Interview with Judith Gertler

August 10, 1993

 

Judith Gertler [00:00:05] This is an oral history interview with Klaus Obermeyer on August 10th, 1993, in Aspen, Colorado, as part of the Aspen Historical Society’s Video History Project. The interviewer is Judith Gertler. Klaus, welcome, and it’s very nice to meet you.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:00:24] Thank you. It’s nice to be here with you, Judy.

 

Judith Gertler [00:00:27] And we’re very pleased that you’ve agreed to participate in this project. Let’s begin with some background information about your life before you came to Aspen. Would you tell us where and when you were born?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:00:40] I was born in Germany in 1919.

 

Judith Gertler [00:00:47] And you grew up in Germany?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:00:48] I grew up there, yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:00:50] What were some of your interests as a boy and as a young man?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:00:55] As a boy, we played Indians, believe it or not. And that was exciting with bows and arrows and shot at each other. There were two tribes. One was headed up by my brother and one was headed up by myself. I was the head of the Sioux tribe.

 

Judith Gertler [00:01:15] And what other kinds of things did you enjoy doing as a boy? As a young man also?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:01:19] Skiing.

 

Judith Gertler [00:01:21] When did you learn to ski?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:01:22] I learned to ski when I was three years old. Um, uh, self-made skis.

 

Judith Gertler [00:01:30] And what were the skis made of?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:01:32] Uh, they were made out of, uh, chestnut, uh, thin chestnut boards that, uh, my, my father used to buy oranges by the crate, and, uh, those crates were made of very thin chestnut boards, and I nailed my house shoes, my buckled house shoes. They were the first buckled boots, by the way, the house shoes onto the, uh, boards, put the string around the front part of the board, pulled it up and tied it around my leg below the knee. So when I bent my knees forward, I had no more tips. But when I was standing upright, I had tips, you see. And so those were the first skis.

 

Judith Gertler [00:02:19] And your family skied also?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:02:22] Uh, my family learned to ski later. I was the first one in my family to ski.

 

Judith Gertler [00:02:27] And as you were growing up, did you ski a lot as a, as a young man and as a, in your early 20s?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:02:33] I skied in the winter, every day. Every evening after school was out. We had little jumping hill next to the house, and that was made out of snow, and we jumped. We had a little, uh, prize jumping there every afternoon.

 

Judith Gertler [00:02:49] Skiing was a very important part of your life from the very beginning. Almost from the time that you could walk.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:02:54] Oh, yeah. The skiing has fascinated me. It’s fabulous.

 

Judith Gertler [00:02:59] As you grew up, you went to school, and you became an aeronautical engineer?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:03] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:03:04] Did you have a degree in that or…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:05] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:03:06] And then what kind of work did you do as an engineer?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:10] Well, I built airplanes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:03:13] And this was in what time period?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:15] That was during the war in Munich or near Munich. And I worked for Dornier aircraft factory.

 

Judith Gertler [00:03:26] And on the phone, you told me that prior to coming to the United States, you worked on an English-German… was it a dictionary? Is that…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:35] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:03:36] And what was…. How did that come about?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:03:38] Well. There was a funny little thing. While I was in the hospital recovering from a bullet wound and a broken leg, uh, trying to get into Switzerland, and they didn’t want me to go yet. Um, I wrote this little, little book because I thought that’s the first thing that is going to be needed is, when the war is over, is that someone can say, “Well, what is this in English? And what is this in German?” And, and so the little book was entitled “English Official Language.” And, and so the American soldiers bought it, was handy for them. And, and, and a lot of the German population bought it. Was a lousy little book, but, uh, but it was the only one on the market.

 

Judith Gertler [00:04:36] And how did you learn English?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:04:39] Well, I studied English during the war.

 

Judith Gertler [00:04:42] And what else did you do during the war?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:04:45] Uh, during the war, I worked as an engineer.

 

Judith Gertler [00:04:48] That’s right.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:04:49] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:04:50] Well…

 

Kevin Padden (sound) [00:04:51] Excuse me, can I change the microphone?

 

Greg Poschman (camera) [00:04:54] Let’s cut.

 

Kevin Padden (sound) [00:04:55] It’s getting a little close. The noise there…

 

{break}

 

Kevin Padden (sound) [00:04:58] Is that okay?

 

Greg Poschman (camera) [00:05:00] Okay, I am rolling. Go ahead.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:03] You said that you were in the hospital recovering and that you had wanted to go to Switzerland. When did you actually leave Germany?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:10] I tried to leave Germany, uh, at the end of the, at the end of the war, which was about, was in March, in April or May…

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:22] This is 1945?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:23] In 1945. But that’s a long, long story. And, and, uh, we’ll be here for two hours.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:32] Perhaps another time.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:33] Yeah. We get hungry.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:37] Well, let’s, let’s get you to the United States.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:40] All right.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:41] So when did you actually arrive in the United States?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:44] In February of ’47.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:46] And where was the first place that you went?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:05:49] New York.

 

Judith Gertler [00:05:52] Um…

 

Greg Poschman (camera) [00:05:57] Sorry, I didn’t mean to break your concentration.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:00] That’s okay, um…

 

Greg Poschman (camera) [00:06:01] Well, I was just, the comment I was just making is that if we could get full sentences. “I came to the US in…”

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:07] Oh, okay. Fine.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:12] Let’s start the segment again. Okay. It’s okay. That’s fine. Um, Klaus, you came to the United States in 1947, and where was the first place that you went?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:24] The first place that I went to was New York.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:27] And did you come to New York alone?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:30] Yes, I came to New York alone.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:33] How old were you when you came to the United States?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:37] I was about 27 years old.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:41] And you didn’t stay in New York long. I understand that you went to Idaho quite soon after you arrived in New York.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:48] Yes. I stayed in New York all summer. And then in the fall, I went to Sun Valley, Idaho.

 

Judith Gertler [00:06:55] How did you happen to go to Sun Valley, Idaho?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:06:58] Friedl Pfeifer was running the ski school in Sun Valley, and I had written to him, and he had invited me to teach skiing there.

 

Judith Gertler [00:07:07] And of course, you had had a lot of skiing experience. So this was… had you had experience teaching also in Germany?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:07:13] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:07:14] You had, you did have experience teaching in Germany. Um, you did go to Sun Valley. What happened when you got to Sun Valley?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:07:23] That was amazing. When I arrived in Sun Valley, first of all, everybody was very, very nice and friendly. It was a different world from New York, like day and night. Uh, the bus driver said, “Well, you’re going to need a job here. Maybe I can help you find a job.” I mean, they were just absolutely terrific. And, um, so the first thing I wanted to do is see Friedl Pfeifer, and they said, “Oh, Freidl Pfeifer is in Aspen.” I said, “Thank you.” And I went across from the Challenger Inn to the Aspen Chalet and said, “I like to speak to Friedl.” They said, “Oh, Friedl, he’s in Aspen.” I said, “Well, isn’t this Aspen?” They laughed and said, “No, you know, Aspen is 800 miles away from here.” And, um, so I went back to the Challenger Inn, to the pay phone, and I called Otto Lang, who had taken over the ski school in Sun Valley. But he was down in Hollywood with 20th Century Fox, and he was very nice. He said, “Chances are, we, you can work here 90%. Uh, and, uh, so stick around. I’ll be up there in December.” And, uh, Fred Iselin was outside the phone booth, uh, overhearing, overhearing the conversation. He said, “Well,” he said, “why don’t you come to Aspen?” Said, “So, you come and have dinner with Elli and myself tonight, and we will call Friedl, and you should come to Aspen.”

 

Judith Gertler [00:09:00] And that’s what happened?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:09:01] So, so, at dinner, Elli cooked a phenomenal Austrian dinner and, uh, that evening. And they called Friedl Pfeifer, and, and Friedl said, “Yeah, come to Aspen.” So, so that, that, that’s the beginning.

 

Judith Gertler [00:09:16] How did you actually get to Aspen? Did you take the train, or did you fly or…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:09:22] I took the train, yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:09:24] And where did the train let you off?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:09:25] See the bus… You took the bus from Sun Valley to Shoshone, Idaho. From Shoshone, Idaho, you got Union Pacific to Salt Lake City, and then you changed trains. And then from Salt Lake City, you came to Glenwood Springs.

 

Judith Gertler [00:09:40] And from Glenwood, how did you get in?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:09:43] From Glenwood, you went over a washboard kind of a road, uh, up to Aspen. And there happened to be some other people, they wanted to also go to Aspen. They gave me a ride.

 

Judith Gertler [00:09:57] Do you remember back that day in 1947, when you drove into Aspen on that rough road, what were some of your first impressions of the town as you drove in?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:07] You know, my first impression was this town never will make it.

 

Judith Gertler [00:10:15] Why did you have that feeling?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:17] Well, there, there were more dogs in the town than people. There were all dogs, all over, was the most amazing… I’ve never seen so many dogs that were all related, but different again from each other.

 

Judith Gertler [00:10:31] And what did you notice about the country, the surroundings of Aspen, the mountains? And how did that look to you?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:37] That looked great.

 

Judith Gertler [00:10:40] Did it look like it would be good for skiing?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:41] Oh, absolutely.

 

Judith Gertler [00:10:43] Where did you stay when you first got into town?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:47] I stayed at the Hotel Jerome.

 

Judith Gertler [00:10:48] Do you remember how much it cost in those days? For a night or a week or however?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:10:54] I think it probably was something like $5 a night, if I am not mistaken.

 

Judith Gertler [00:11:01] And it’s kind of a… After you got here, did you immediately start teaching? Was that…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:11:08] Yes. Yes, we, I started immediately to teach.

 

Judith Gertler [00:11:13] Okay. Well, before we talk about your teaching, I’d like to talk a little bit about your life in Aspen. Um, as you were here for a while, Klaus, what was it that helped you decide that this was a place that you wanted to stay?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:11:30] I think mainly what helped me decide, decide to stay in Aspen was the phenomenal climate. Phenomenal snow, very dry, fluffy snow, and a dry, wonderful climate, and, and an amazing, uh, uh, situation created by the fact that Aspen is so high. The town of Aspen is almost as high as the highest mountain in Bavaria, and it’s very far south. It’s as far south as the Strait of Messina between Italy and Sicily. So it’s a, it’s an incredible climate here. And I loved it.

 

Judith Gertler [00:12:13] That was a real attraction for you.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:12:15] There was a real attraction, and nice people. Other nice people who had come here, like Pete Seibert and Stein Eriksen, came here in the early days for the race, for FIS race.

 

Judith Gertler [00:12:28] Do you have some stories about some of those people that you met early on in your stay in Aspen? What about any stories about Stein Eriksen or about anyone else that that you met in town or that you knew here?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:12:42] Yeah, I think they were all great people. I, uh, I remember Pete Seibert dreaming of building his own ski area, and I always told him, I said, “Pete, we don’t even have enough work to teach here in Aspen. There are not enough people wanting to ski. And here you want to do yet another ski area.” And he pursued that doggedly and ended up building Vail, you know. So, uh, and I for a while, I lived with Pete Seibert and his mother and his sister in town in the little house here in the West End.

 

Judith Gertler [00:13:22] Anyone else come to mind from those early days that, that you met and that, that you made a connection with and that had some impact on Aspen?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:13:32] Well, Walter Paepcke, naturally. Walter and I, we played chess. We started playing chess sometimes in the evening, 9:00 after dinner and, and were finished just in time for me to go to the Ski School Meeting Place in the morning. So…

 

Judith Gertler [00:13:51] How did you meet Walter?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:13:54] Well, he was, when I came here, he was in the Jerome Hotel lobby, you know. Nice man, very special man. Very bright and very wonderful.

 

Judith Gertler [00:14:06] Did you also meet his wife?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:14:08] Yes, yes. She was very stunningly beautiful and, and charming and intelligent and wonderful.

 

Judith Gertler [00:14:16] What…did you do anything with Elizabeth Paepcke also? I mean, I know you played chess with Walter, and I imagine, did you ski with Walter also?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:14:25] Uh, Walter did not ski.

 

Judith Gertler [00:14:26] He didn’t ski?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:14:27] No.

 

Judith Gertler [00:14:27] But she did ski?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:14:29] But she… Yeah. Elizabeth skied. Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:14:34] Um. This may seem sort of a strange question coming now, but in those early days, did you foresee your life in Aspen? Did you have any dreams or plans of what you wanted to do here?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:14:53] Not really. All I wanted to do is ski. I’m just a born ski bum. And so I think, you know, what developed then was that because of, uh, teaching skiing, I found so many things were, were missing. People were cold. People burned up in the sunshine. There was no suntan lotion that worked. But mainly people were cold riding up that 15-minute Number One Lift ride. And so, I started making things to keep them warm so they stayed in class because I kept losing my students because they were uncomfortable.

 

Judith Gertler [00:15:37] Let’s go to that period of your life when you were teaching.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:15:41] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:15:42] Um, before we talk about how you began to make things, to make skiers more comfortable, I’d like to talk a little bit about teaching, skiing. Teaching of skiing.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:15:51] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:15:52] What was the mountain called in those days? It’s now called Aspen Mountain or Ajax. What was the mountain called in those days?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:16:00] Same. Aspen Mountain or Ajax.

 

Judith Gertler [00:16:02] And, um, do you remember what you were paid when you were, when the Ski School was just starting and you were starting to teach?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:16:12] Yes. I hardly remember it because it was so little. I got $10 a day…if you worked. If you didn’t work, naturally, there was no money. For half a day, you were paid $5. And for private lessons, private lessons were $7.50 an hour. And, uh, if you had worked more than four hours, you got to keep half of the private lesson money.

 

Judith Gertler [00:16:43] Did people tip in those days? Did they tip you?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:16:45] Some tipped. Yeah. Some did tip.

 

Judith Gertler [00:16:50] Um, were there, about how many instructors were there in the time that you were teaching at the beginning? I know you taught for about twelve years.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:16:58] There were about ten of us.

 

Judith Gertler [00:16:59] There were about ten instructors. And any stand out that you remember? Anybody’s name that you remember particularly?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:17:08] Not really. I mean, we all tried to make a living and have fun at the same time.

 

Judith Gertler [00:17:15] Um. Was there a unified way to teach or did everyone teach his own style?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:17:21] No, there was a unified way.

 

Judith Gertler [00:17:23] And what was that way and who defined it?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:17:25] Uh, that was defined by Friedl and Fred, and it was based on two things. Uh, first of all, the vertical spring in your legs, which to this day is the most important thing in skiing. And secondly, uh, on a rotating motion, in other words, when you turn to the right, you brought your left shoulder forward, and that later was abandoned. Uh, but under Friedl and Fred, that was the method. And it worked, you know.

 

Judith Gertler [00:18:04] Did you enjoy teaching?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:18:05] I loved it, yeah. I met so many nice, nice people. It was a lot of fun.

 

Judith Gertler [00:18:10] Where did people come from who wanted to learn to ski in those days?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:18:14] Many came from Denver, socialites from Denver. And then we had the people here from Hollywood, like Gary Cooper and, and Ingrid Bergman came up, and Van Johnson, uh, Paul Draper, the famous dancer. So, so, so, and then from New York, Frank Scavullo came out here, the fashion photo mogul in New York, still to this day, um, he’s getting a little older now, like we all do. Uh, so people came from all over.

 

Judith Gertler [00:18:52] Do you have some stories about teaching people to ski? Anything that you remember that stands out for you?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:18:59] Yeah, I have a story. There was Mrs. Bissell, from the Bissell vacuum cleaner, uh, outfit in, I guess, the Michigan. And, uh, she was a little bit scared of the mountain, and I don’t blame her because there was no grooming then. It was pretty rough. And, uh, so she was taking lessons, private lessons, from me on Little Nell. And one day, she said, “You know what, Klaus? I would love to ski all the way down the big mountain. Would you spend all of Sunday with me to take me down?” And I said okay. I mean, she hardly could do a snowplow turn. So that was, I knew that I was in for a real problem, but, uh, that Sunday morning, it snowed. It stormed so hard; it was unbelievable. I mean, it was snowing horizontally. And I said, “Well, do you still want to, want to come down Aspen Mountain?” She said, “Yes, I would love to come down Aspen Mountain.” So we went up in the, in the storm, you know, the Number One Lift that they had these hoods over them, you could pull a hood over you, and it was cold, and get up on the Number Two Lift. And we got in the Sundeck and warmed up. You could see nothing. Everything was white. The air was white, the snow was white, the trees were white. Everything was white. You almost got vertigo. And so I skied down with her. It took us five hours, and wherever we could take a little road, you know, we took a road and traversed. And then, when she fell, I lifted her up so she had enough strength left to make it all the way down. And so she must have fallen, I don’t know, maybe 200 times. But I got her down in one piece and everything, just everything was still white. We got to the bottom of Little Nell, it was white, and I said, “Well, we’re down.” She said, “No, are we really?” I said, “Yes, we’re down.” She said, “Can we do that again??” I said I needed the money, and I said okay. She gave me a $50 tip, you know? And so the next day, Monday, was a beautiful, sunny, wonderful, wonderful Colorado day. We took Number One Lift up. We took Number Two Lift up. We started out from the Sundeck, and when she looked down, uh, Dipsy Doodle, she said, “You know what, Klaus? I’ll pay you for the whole day, but I’m not going to do it.” So when she could see what it looked like, she didn’t do it anymore.

 

Judith Gertler [00:21:56] That’s a great story. You mentioned that you needed the money and, and actually, what you were paid. Can you give us an idea of what things cost in those days? Like if you went for… Were there any restaurants in town? I know there were a few restaurants in town.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:22:14] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:22:14] What, what… if you wanted to get a hamburger or a, you know, a beer or something? Do you remember at all what things cost, around?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:22:23] Yeah, they were very reasonable. I mean, you could buy a hamburger for, for $0.25, you know. And so we didn’t have many $0.25.

 

Judith Gertler [00:22:41] Let’s get back, um, to, to your, to teaching again. One other question I wanted to ask you, I know there was Lift One and Lift Two, and the Sundeck existed. Were there any other lifts on the mountain at that time?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:22:55] There was just number… Well, there was the T-bar lift on Little Nell, number one lift, number two. That was it.

 

Judith Gertler [00:23:01] Good. Well, as you, you started to tell us before, your teaching of skiing led you to some important discoveries about the needs of skiers, in terms of equipment, in terms of clothing, etc. Um, what was it…? What did you learn from, from your students as you were teaching, and learn from other people who were skiing, about their needs as skiers?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:23:23] Well, they were cold and miserable when they were, when, you know, on a cold day, they were freezing because there was no real ski clothing.

 

Judith Gertler [00:23:32] What did people wear?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:23:33] Yeah. They wore, they wore some kind of a sweater and then a shell over that. And going up, going up Number One Lift, we had the regular city winter coats. You know, you put on a winter coat, and so you, you rode up the lift. That took 15 minutes, if it didn’t stop, and, and then you sent the coat, the city coat, back down on the lift. And you… because you couldn’t ski in those bulky things. And so, you know, it took us 2.5 minutes to ski down and 15 to go up. So you had one warm ride up. The next ride, you got down to the bottom, your coat hadn’t arrived yet. So you had one cold ride up. And the next time around you, you, you had the warm ride up again. But some people were very rich. They had two coats, you know, and, and so they had a warm ride up every time. And, and what I did, you know, Art Pfister had this phenomenal raccoon coat, and the days I knew he wasn’t skiing, I borrowed it. But don’t tell him! He still doesn’t know.

 

Judith Gertler [00:24:49] And what were people skiing on? What did skis look like in those days? What were they made of and what did they look like?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:24:57] The skis were, were much longer, for one thing, usually 215, 2 meter 15 (cm), and they were somewhat stiffer, and they were made out of wood.

 

Judith Gertler [00:25:09] And what, how did they attach to the boots? Were there straps, safety straps or…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:25:14] Yeah, you had the binding. But first, at that time, you had just regular uh, uh, bindings that were not release bindings, so you didn’t need the safety strap because you never came out of the binding, except if you broke the ski right there.

 

Judith Gertler [00:25:33] And what about boots? What were boots like?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:25:35] Boots were leather boots, uh, uncomfortable and usually didn’t fit right. So…

 

Judith Gertler [00:25:45] You know, I’m listening to what people wore and how cold they were, and, and about what we know now is the primitive kinds of skis and boots, etc. What do you think it was about skiing in those days? That people who would come just for a week or two weeks would… what kept them doing it? What was the impetus for people…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:26:08] Well, the excitement. I mean, the excitement of speed. The excitement of going through the snow. That’s kind of a neat feeling, you know? That’s almost a sexy feeling to go through, through powder snow, and so it… and the fresh air and the sunshine and, and the company. And it just, you know, it’s a, it’s a great sport. It’s just the greatest sport.

 

Judith Gertler [00:26:40] Let’s go back to your thinking about what you could do to, perhaps, to make skiers more comfortable and perhaps to make them, help them ski better because they’d be more comfortable. Do you remember when you got the idea that you could do something, you could make something, you could manufacture something, you could change something for skiers?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:27:02] Well, I will tell you what happened. I kept losing the students. Everybody did. Every instructor. You had them on Monday and Tuesday. And then on Wednesday, half of them showed up. And on Thursday you had no more class usually. And, and that was mainly because they, they, they just were uncomfortably cold in December and January and even February. So, I cut up my, my down comforter that I brought from Europe with me and, and made the first down parka out of it, and I looked like Michelin Man, you know. It was huge, but it was warm and so, and everybody said, “Jesus, can I borrow your down parka once? Let me just see what that feels like.” And they put it on, and they loved it. And so I thought, “Man, maybe I ought to make some.” And so, so we made some.

 

Judith Gertler [00:27:57] You bought old comforters or you…? How…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:27:59] No. No, no, no, we made them regular down parkas. I went back to Munich the next summer and, and we figured out, first of all, to make a quilted parka. You know, we made the first, not just down, but the first quilted parka. We put…there were no insulations available then like they have now, like DuPont makes these fabulous insulations. Uh, so what we did, in a factory, a friend of mine in Munich had a factory, and we, we took the floor sweepings and used it as insulation, little threads and little pieces of material, all that stuff that’s in a textile factory on the floor. And we put it in, and we made this double parka and put, put it in, filled that stuff inside of it, and then everything settled on the bottom. You looked like a, uh, some, uh, somebody filled, filled with water, you know. So then we thought, well, maybe if we put seams around it, so, so we can keep this stuff from settling to the bottom. So that’s how we made the first quilted parka, and it was really warm. And I imported those right away, and people loved them. They were great. And, and then the down parka, that was the next thing. They were warmer. And so we made those in Europe in a, in a factory that was making comforters, you know, not, not a parka factory, because there was no such thing.

 

Judith Gertler [00:29:30] Did that also catch on in Germany or in Europe? Once, once you…

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:29:34] Oh, yes. Yes. But you know, in Europe it wasn’t needed as badly because the climate was a little milder there, uh, most of the time. And they had the big, uh, cable cars. You went inside the cable car, and so you were not cold going up. Here you sat on the chairlift, and that was a cold ride.

 

Judith Gertler [00:29:55] What year are we talking about, Klaus? When did you go to Munich to, to make…

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:30:00] ’48. ’49. ’50.

 

Judith Gertler [00:30:05] Well, that turned… the beginning… That turned into a, to a real business. It was the beginning, in a sense, of Sport Obermeyer. Is that true?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:30:16] Yes, well, not, not really, because well, I was teaching skiing. And at night, I kind of figured it out a little bit, and I just sold it to my students, you know, and every once in a while then, I had a sporting goods dealer in my class, and they said, “Hey, I could use, I could sell this, uh, uh, in my store.” Like I had Hugh Gallarneau that used to play for the Chicago Bears, and he was the head of the sporting goods section at Marshall Field’s in Chicago. And he said, “Klaus, I could sell this on the fifth floor of Marshall…”

 

{Tape runs out.}

 

Judith Gertler [00:30:53] Klaus, you were talking about how you would make parkas at night and sell them to some of your students, and that sometimes, someone in your class might say that they could distribute them. Would you start that again, please, and let us know?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:31:05] Oh yeah. Once in a while, I had a sporting goods dealer in my class, and they said, “Hey, I could use these boots or these sweaters, I could, or parkas. I could sell that in my store.” And so that’s how I got, uh, national distribution, you know. One dealer in New York, the Norse House, and Carroll Reed in North Conway; they bought some of this stuff, and Pete Lane in Sun Valley bought some. And naturally, Steve Knowlton here, who had Knowlton Sports, uh, he, he sold some of it. And so, so, so the next thing you knew, I had national distribution. It wasn’t big, but it was a distribution.

 

Judith Gertler [00:31:47] Where were you manufacturing, if you said boots, and a few other things?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:31:51] Boots we were making in Germany, and the jackets, we were making everything in Germany because that’s where I had my ties and knew people and could get things done.

 

Judith Gertler [00:32:02] So you would go back and forth to Germany and help design and help supervise manufacturing?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:32:08] Right.

 

Judith Gertler [00:32:08] And then in the winter, you’d be here to teach skiing?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:32:11] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:32:11] Did you also live here at other times during the year?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:32:16] At first, no. At first, I was not here in the summer because there was nothing going on in the summer. And I guess the summer of ’47, ’48, there was one log house being built. Andy Ransom, one of the instructors, was building that. There was just no work.

 

Judith Gertler [00:32:36] How did you actually begin what became Sport Obermeyer? Here. How did you…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:32:43] Yeah, well, by, by doing the first, the first things. I designed a logo, a Sport Obermeyer logo with a heart and a ski pole through it in the very, very early days. And then later we just, uh, retained the heart, took the ski pole out. It looked pretty brutal, you know, with… So, so actually that started right at the beginning, ’47, ’48.

 

Judith Gertler [00:33:15] And as you began getting more into manufacturing, you eventually stopped teaching. How long did you teach?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:33:22] I taught for 12 years.

 

Judith Gertler [00:33:24] And then how, how did the business develop or how did you…?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:33:28] Well, it got bigger. It got bigger and bigger, and I needed more sweaters, and I needed more parkas. And, and then we were making also hats, and we were making, starting to make gloves, pre-shaped gloves. The first pre-shaped gloves, you know, where instead of straight fingers, you had, you, it was bent like your hand is really so you’re warmer, and things like that. Just, there was this tremendous opportunity, uh, because there was nothing on the market. And, and so, and then there were more and more and more skiers. And so it just started, uh, going, not because I planned it like this, but it just happened. If I would have planned it, it wouldn’t have worked.

 

Judith Gertler [00:34:16] Did you draw on your early training as an engineer?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:34:21] Absolutely, absolutely. That, that that, that was a very, that was very important to, uh, the engineering background, to develop all these things, because the factories were not accustomed to making parkas or making boots that worked right. So, so because of the engineering background, I was able to tell them, “Well, maybe if you do it like this or you can do this or that way, you can do it.” And they said, “But, but we have never done it.” And I always told them, said, “Well, I’ll buy it from you. You know, you make it like I tell you to, and I will buy all of it from you, so you don’t have to worry. You do not have a risk that you’re taking.” And so that’s, that’s what made it work in the end.

 

Judith Gertler [00:35:16] Did you save your money through these years so that you could begin to put some into manufacturing and then make some more? How did that work?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:35:24] Yes, I always, I saved the money that I was making teaching skiing and uh, uh, and I kept saving and saving because… And the most I saved, when I went up to Alaska one summer to operate a crane, hydro, a big, a big crane. Um, and I made a lot of money up there. And, and Gale Spence from Aspen Sports later, he was up there building houses, and so we both saved up enough money. He started Aspen Sports, and I was then able to really do Sport Obermeyer on a larger scale.

 

Judith Gertler [00:36:06] So when, what year did you stop teaching?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:36:10] I, I don’t know what year it was. It was 12, I taught for 12 years, so it must…  So ’47, so that must have been…

 

Judith Gertler [00:36:17] ’59.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:36:18] Yeah. Somewhere around 1959, ’60. Somewhere there.

 

Judith Gertler [00:36:28] Did anyone else help you start the business, once you based it here in, in Aspen?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:36:34] No.

 

Judith Gertler [00:36:34] Did it all yourself.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:36:35] I did it by myself. It’s, it’s difficult to have a partner in a business, you know, that’s kind of, almost like a marriage.

 

Judith Gertler [00:36:46] Speaking of marriage, I’m going to ask you about that later, but we’ll come to that later. Um, how has being based in a small town like Aspen affected your company, both in a, perhaps, a positive way? And have there been any drawbacks?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:37:01] Oh, well, there, there were certain drawbacks at first because nothing was, nothing much was locally available. So you had to go to Glenwood Springs or to Grand Junction or to Denver to buy certain, certain supplies. But, um, the… I think the advantages way, uh, were way bigger than the disadvantages. The advantages were that you were living the business that you’re in. You skied every day. You talk to people, you see what their needs were and how to fill them best. And, and, and so you live your, your profession really. And so, in the end, all our competition from New York City and San Francisco and others, they are, they are no longer in business. We still are in business today because we live it and love it, and did it not just for the money, mainly to service the people to, to come with a product that is good for people, that will work for them, that will make their lives better, you know? And then if you’re not dumb, money comes as a secondary thing. But money should never be primary anyhow.

 

Judith Gertler [00:38:21] That sounds as if that could be, have been your philosophy for your business.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:38:26] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:38:27] Could you describe again what your, the philosophy of Sport Obermeyer is?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:38:32] The philosophy of Sport Obermeyer is to be here as a service to many thousands of people. We want these people and, and in this case, I’m speaking about skiers or the skiing population, we want them to be better off because we’re here, not worse off. So we want to give them a product that is technically responsible and works well and stay dynamic in keeping developing newer and better things as we go along. And we want them to have a, from us, a price-value relationship that is fair and good. So you don’t have to think whether you should buy a car this year or a ski suit, you know? I think and, and fortunately, because we sell so much now, we are able to produce very reasonably the very, very best obtainable. So we want to be the Mercedes-Benz of, uh, American ski clothing. And we’re getting there, step by little step by little step.

 

Judith Gertler [00:39:54] How would you describe your, the business today, in terms of the industry? Where you are in it?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:39:59] In the ski industry, we’re the largest now in the United States. And we are one of very few companies in the world that have specialized solely in alpine ski wear for children, ladies, and men. We don’t do anything else. We don’t do golf wear; we don’t do tennis wear. We don’t do anything else, but strictly concentrate on, on ski wear and want to make that the very, very best for the money possible, you know.

 

Judith Gertler [00:40:33] You’ve mentioned this, and I’d like you to repeat part of it for, for the record, that you, you’ve pioneered many ski innovations or many innovations in ski wear and in ski gear over the years. What are some of the, some of the ideas that you had and, and were able to bring to production?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:40:52] Oh, there are so many. You know, it’s, it’s a, it’s an ongoing thing every, every day. It is the purpose of our existence to develop and work out better things all the time and have the mills that make the outer materials, for instance, uh, make us outer materials that work better. For instance, we have now an outer material that’s called Super Mycraft, and that is waterproof and breathable by construction, not by coating or by putting some kind of a layer, gluing a layer to it. So, so because it’s a, it’s a microfiber, and it’s so fine and so soft that, that in the weaving they, they weave that under higher pressure, they push one thread against the other with higher pressure so that the little pores are so, so minimal that air can go through it. But water droplets can’t go through it, except if they’re under pressure. Under pressure they would go through. So, so this is fabulous. And it gives you a comfort that is phenomenal. So you’re not too hot. You’re not cold in it. It’s windproof. It does all the wonderful things. And we get that because we need enough yardage of it. I mean, we buy about 3 million yards of outer material a year now. And so the mills, they come to us and say, “Klaus, what is it that you would like? What do you want us to work on?” And so they work maybe for 2 or 3 years on the project and then come up with, with something that is fabulous, you know. So…

 

Judith Gertler [00:42:42] Do you have any stories about how any of your innovations began? For instance, do you have any stories about how you designed gloves that were comfortable or mirrored glasses or how… any, any stories come to mind about any of these?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:43:02] Yeah, well, the mirrored glasses, the mirrored glass…

 

Judith Gertler [00:43:07] Without getting too technical.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:43:08] Yeah. And you’re going to get very technical there. But all I can say that the, what I liked with the mirror glass, and why we promoted it and worked on it for many years, is that it reflects all the ultraviolet rays, totally, 100%, everything. So it’s, it’s very good for your eyes. And then, not only was it a mirror, uh, a model mirror put over the glass, but, but it’s also, was precision ground. So you didn’t have any distortions. And that’s a real important thing. You go in the drugstore and buy a $5 glass; it is not precision ground. It’s a poor lens, and they’re not always even. And it gives you certain distortions, which is bad for the eyes. But I think one, one thing that’s important at this elevation here, where you get such a, so much sun exposure and ultraviolet exposure, is that you have very, very good glasses or you develop a night blindness after a while. So that is an important thing. And Friedl Pfeifer, we talked about Friedl Pfeifer. He was instrumental in getting Friedl Pfeifer Ski Tan developed. That was the first suntan lotion, uh, in the world that reflected or broke down the ultraviolet rays so you didn’t burn, which, that was a phenomenal thing. And later we distributed this under the name Sportana. But Friedl did that. And to this day, this is my most favorite suntan lotion, even though we are not distributing it anymore.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:02] It’s a really important… innovations and developments in skiing.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:07] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:09] Somewhere along the line, you got married.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:11] Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:12] Did you get married in Aspen? Or did you get… Did you meet your wife in Aspen?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:17] I met my wife in Aspen. Yes.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:19] And what was her name or what is her name?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:22] Her name was E.J. Comrie.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:27] And are, are you married now?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:29] No, no, we were divorced a long, we were divorced a long time ago.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:35] And you had some children from this marriage?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:37] Yes. Three children I had from this marriage.

 

Judith Gertler [00:45:41] And what, what are your children’s names?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:45:42] That’s Henry, he’s the oldest one. He’s an engineer, a hydroelectric engineer. And Wally, he is now working in the business with me. And Susie, and she’s also working in the business with me. But then, there was another marriage. And from the next marriage, there was another boy. And he’s wonderful. His name is Klausi, and he is in the video and film business also now.

 

Judith Gertler [00:46:18] So you have four children?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:46:20] Yes. Four children.

 

Judith Gertler [00:46:35] Let’s spend a few minutes looking backwards, as well as looking in the present. What are some of the major changes that you’ve seen in Aspen, in the many years that you’ve been here? Let’s think, let’s talk first, perhaps, about the physical look of the town. Can you think back to what it was like in the ’50s and the ’60s and ’70s, and can you give us a…

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:47:04] I tell you what has been one of the great changes in Aspen early on, and that was blacktopping the streets, because before they were blacktopped, when the wind gusts came, the whole town was in PM10. You have no idea.

 

Judith Gertler [00:47:28] Even worse than today?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:47:28] Oh, much worse. You have no idea what this looked like when the wind came through. And because none of the streets were blacktopped or oiled, and then they started blacktopping and oil… first oiling them and then blacktopping them. That, I think, was a great step forward.

 

Judith Gertler [00:47:47] What about, um, buildings and the look of the town? It’s changed, obviously, in these years. But when you think back to the ’50s and the ’60s and then compare it to today, how, how do you see Aspen?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:48:05] Well, in the ’50s and ’60s, there were many empty lots. And now they are getting to be fewer and fewer. That’s the big difference. The town has just grown up. More people like to come here and live here. And, and some of them even can afford it.

 

Judith Gertler [00:48:27] Have there been changes to the, to the environment? Uh, to the outskirts, to the mountains, to the, to the other areas? Do you see many changes? There certainly has been development of new ski areas, Snowmass, etc., but…

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:48:44] Yes. The changes, I guess, uh, life is a dynamic thing and, and you have to have change and, and so Aspen with a wonderful mountain, uh, kept growing and growing. And not only that, but then you have also the Music Festival and other wonderful cultural going-ons, lectures and so forth. So, uh, that it has attracted some… many, many bright people that… and some of them have bought houses here and live here now. And so, so Aspen has become a very unique little city in this world.

 

Judith Gertler [00:49:27] What have been some of your greatest pleasures about living in Aspen?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:49:33] The greatest pleasure, I think, is the climate and, and the people that Aspen has attracted. I think those two things are wonderful.

 

Judith Gertler [00:49:50] Are you still skiing these days?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:49:52] I ski every day. I skied last winter every day. It was a fabulous winter.

 

Judith Gertler [00:50:00] Um. Has there been anything about your life here, in terms of your public life that has been disappointing? Anything about Aspen that…

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:50:14] Oh, I guess politics has been disappointing all along. They were… 20 years ago when they were talking to build a decent road. And they, they’re still talking about it. So that’s a little bit disappointing. But governments happen to be kind of disappointing the world over usually, and…

 

Judith Gertler [00:50:39] Well, it looks like Aspen has been good for you and that you’ve been wonderful for Aspen.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:50:45] Yeah. Aspen is a wonderful, wonderful town. And, and um, I love it here. Uh, uh, what more can I say?

 

Judith Gertler [00:50:58] We are just about at the end of the interview, and I’m wondering if there is anything that I didn’t ask you or anything that you might want to comment on that you haven’t talked about?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:51:10] Well, I think we touched on the business before, and, and you asked me the philosophy of our business. Part of the philosophy, uh, is that, uh, we are in a, not in a short-term profit syndrome like most companies are forced to be. Okay. So, we have the luxury of always making decisions that make us a better company in the long run, rather than to make a quick dollar today. That is one of them. And the other one is, uh, that we, we run a company that runs itself somehow, where the, the employees or the people or the team players in it, uh, have much to say. Uh, so it’s a kind of a grassroots company rather than one dictated from the top down. And it has worked very well, and when you come into our company, you see people smile. And the reason for it is that these people are free people and not slaves to something. They’re there because they love it and they’re excited and it’s wonderful and it’s fun for them. Okay. And I think that is a very important part of the philosophy of the business.

 

Judith Gertler [00:52:30] How do you think that you’ve been able to build a business with that philosophy?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:52:36] I’ve built that business on that philosophy because that is my philosophy. I believe, I believe in freedom. I don’t believe in slavery. Uh, I believe in great products, and I believe in, in, in, in having fun while you’re here because you live a relatively short time and, and, and I think it’s important to make that life and that business that you are doing, to make it fun and exciting and wonderful, you know, so…

 

Judith Gertler [00:53:11] That’s, that is wonderful. To go from the macro to the micro, um, one other question. Does, does Sport…Sport Obermeyer doesn’t make equipment anymore, do… or do you still make equipment?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:53:26] No, we, we are out of the equipment business with, with…

 

Judith Gertler [00:53:30] Klaus, why are, why is Sport Obermeyer not, no longer making equipment?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:53:34] Well, they have a great saying in Bavaria, and it says, “you can’t dance at every wedding.” So, so we have specialized, uh, in order to become the best in the world. And that’s what we’re aiming for in alpine ski clothing. We are specialized to do just that and do it well. And, and you can’t do everything well. Otherwise… you have to kind of concentrate your energies, you know.

 

Judith Gertler [00:54:03] When you came here in 1947, did you have any idea that many years later you would be in the position that you’re in now?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:54:15] No, no. I didn’t. I had no idea that I would be in this position, and I did not really aim at it either. It just kind of developed, you know. Kind of a lucky thing, and lots of good people helping us get to where we are.

 

Judith Gertler [00:54:36] Is there anything else that you might like to tell us about the old days or about the, the recent days? Anything?

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:54:44] Yes. I will tell you what I would like to see. I would like to see, uh, a lift coming up Little Annie and another lift going all the way up, uh, Steeplechase from the bottom, connecting Aspen Mountain with Highlands. And then I like to see a little horizontal lift, uh, from the base of Highlands to the base of Buttermilk. And then I like to see a lift from the top of Buttermilk to Snowmass. And that way we would save a lot of traffic, and it’d be fun to ski, and we would have a real ski circuit, and hopefully, eventually that will happen.

 

Judith Gertler [00:55:25] Well, I want to say thank you very much. It’s been a pleasure talking with you.

 

Klaus Obermeyer [00:55:29] Well, the pleasure was all mine. Thank you.